The Senate Health, Education, Labor, and Pensions (HELP) Committee hearing took a sharp turn Tuesday as Sen. John Kennedy (R-LA) questioned Health and Human Services (HHS) Secretary Robert F. Kennedy Jr. over proposed budget cuts to federal health agencies, sparking a heated exchange that shifted the tone of the session.

The Biden-Harris administration’s proposed budget includes $18 billion in cuts to the National Institutes of Health (NIH) and $3.6 billion from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC). Secretary Kennedy defended the reductions, stating, “We’re cutting waste, we’re cutting duplicative programs.”

Democrats, led by Sen. Tammy Baldwin (D-WI), challenged Kennedy over the changes.

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Baldwin criticized what she said would be a $3 billion reduction in federally funded biomedical research, resulting in 3,200 fewer grants.

She framed the cuts as harmful to critical, potentially life-saving programs. Kennedy responded by pointing to inefficiencies in how funds have been used in the past.

“We spend 70% of the world’s biomedical research out of NIH. Seventy percent. And we’re the sickest country in the world,” he said.

“We’ve had a 38% increase in our agency growth over the past four years. That money has not been well spent.”

Senator Tammy Baldwin (D-WI) led the charge, slamming Kennedy for a $3 billion drop in federally funded biomedical research compared to last year.

Kennedy stood his ground.

“We’re cutting waste, we’re cutting duplicative programs,” he said.

Still, Baldwin wouldn’t let up. She… pic.twitter.com/HPM3XAWEtj

— The Vigilant Fox 🦊 (@VigilantFox) May 20, 2025

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The exchange underscored the broader dispute between the parties—Democrats defending current levels of public health funding and Republicans questioning the return on investment and financial accountability of large federal agencies.

Sen. Kennedy then took the floor and quickly shifted the conversation with a line of questioning that emphasized efficiency and accountability in government spending.

After pointing out that HHS staffing levels had dropped from 82,000 to 62,000—back to pre-COVID levels—Sen. Kennedy asked, “Is this the first time that an institution in America has ever downsized?”

Secretary Kennedy replied, “I don’t think so.”

Kennedy followed up with corporate examples: “Microsoft just announced that they were going to reduce their workforce by 6,000 people. You think that’ll be the end of Microsoft?” he asked.

“I don’t think so,” RFK Jr. answered.

“Meta—I still call them Facebook—just announced they’re going to reduce their workforce by 3,000 people. You think that’ll be the end of Meta?”

“I imagine it will not,” Kennedy replied.

“Think maybe the people at Meta know what they’re doing?” Sen. Kennedy asked.

“I think that they do,” RFK Jr. said. “They make a lot of money.”

Kennedy also asked whether RFK Jr. “hates” NIH, to which the secretary responded, “I love NIH. I grew up with NIH. I visited when I was a boy. I loved science, and those were my favorite afternoons visiting the labs.”

The Louisiana senator then turned to what he called misuse of NIH grants by major universities.

“Let’s suppose NIH gives a university $100 million for medical research. That university takes $30 million of it, doesn’t spend it on the research, and uses it to subsidize the rest of their university. Does that show a commitment to medical research?” he asked.

Kennedy cited Stanford University, claiming it was taking up to 78% in indirect costs and asked RFK Jr. if that was acceptable.

“That’s theft, isn’t it?” he said.

“In Louisiana, we call that stealing.”

RFK Jr. responded that private foundations such as the Gates and Rockefeller Foundations typically limit indirect cost coverage to 10%–15%, whereas NIH has historically paid universities much higher rates, in the 50%–70% range. He acknowledged that this created concerns over accountability.

Kennedy closed by asking, “Why do we allow highly processed foods in America?”

“That’s a complicated question,” RFK Jr. replied, attributing the situation to food industry profits and noting that many of the harmful chemicals are not allowed in similar products sold in Canada or Europe.

In his final remarks, Sen. Kennedy acknowledged the political tension surrounding the secretary’s role.

“You understand, Mr. Secretary, there’s nothing you can do that’s going to make many of my Democratic colleagues happy. You get that, don’t you?”

“I do understand,” RFK Jr. said.

“I’m coming to understand that, Senator. Yes.”

Then came Senator John Kennedy, and he dismantled the entire narrative with a few simple questions.

Before I break it down, you should really watch the full exchange for yourself. It’s nothing short of glorious. pic.twitter.com/3Z4mWtKz5l

— The Vigilant Fox 🦊 (@VigilantFox) May 20, 2025

The hearing ended with renewed attention on federal health spending practices, the role of university research grants, and internal government accountability, as Republicans continue to press for reforms amid proposed budget reductions.

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