A discussion between David and Nick Shirley has drawn renewed attention to what they describe as a wide-ranging fraud scheme in Minnesota involving interpreter services, transportation providers, and other state-funded programs, adding to ongoing scrutiny of alleged abuse tied to publicly funded social services.

During the exchange, David described how interpreter services are billed when Somali patients visit medical providers, alleging that the costs quickly escalate and are charged to the state regardless of actual need.

“When a Somali goes to the doctor, magically, they forgot how to speak English, so they needed interpreter there,” David said.

“So the county brings in an interpreter at $100 an hour, minimum, eight hours, to interpret what the doctor is telling the patient.”

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Nick Shirley responded by suggesting that this aspect of the system has received little public attention.

“So that's another layer of fraud that nobody's even talked about or revealed,” Nick Shirley said.

David said the interpreter billing alone represents a massive financial burden, independent of other alleged fraud schemes already under investigation.

“And it's, it's millions and millions, and millions, hundreds of millions of dollars, all on its own interpreter services,” David said.

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Nick Shirley then questioned whether interpreter services are genuinely necessary in many of these cases, particularly for individuals who were born in the United States.

“What percentage do you think of these people, especially if they were born here in the United States, they speak English right?” Nick Shirley asked.

“Of course they do,” David replied.

“They should not be saying ‘No English,’” Nick Shirley said.

David went on to explain that interpreter services are not the only costs associated with the alleged scheme, pointing to transportation as a critical and recurring expense that compounds the financial impact.

“And then remember, the interpreter has to get to the doctor's office or the hospital. How are they getting there? The transportation company, and then they got to get back home, and that patient had to get to the doctor's office. How? Tansportation,” David said.

“Kids got to get to school, how? Transportation. That's why I said the transportation is the hub of really, I think all of this.”

Nick Shirley summarized the broader scope of what they believe is an interconnected network of fraudulent operations tied together by state funding streams.

“So basically, we're talking about between all these fraudulent businesses, the daycare, the autism centers, the adult daycare, the home services, and then the transportation,” Nick Shirley said.

“And then on top of that, you have it looped in with them, going eventually to the doctors for translators to be paid by the state.”

David agreed with that assessment.

“That's exactly what's happening. Yes,” he said.

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