Tucker Carlson welcomed “Superman” and “Madam Secretary” actor Tim Daly to his show Thursday night to discuss the government’s budget proposal that will defund the National Endowment for the Arts.

Carlson began the interview by proclaiming that he is not against the arts. “I just don’t know why average people in a country in which the middle class is shrinking and getting poorer every year ought to be subsidizing rich people in order to pay for art,” said the host.

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Watch the two go head-to-head on federal funding for the arts — including an interesting analogy about fly fishing — in the clip above.